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Nigel

Ideas for a new contest : Field Battles

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The feedback on the Siege That contest was really encouraging. So I have started to think about what the next Crusader 2 contest could be. I quite liked idea of field battles, that came up during the last contest. :)

 

Two big armies fighting on a map with tactical features, maneuvering to move into the best position and skirmishing at the flanks to gain an advantage before moving in on the main clash.

 

Lord Chris also mentioned that we could hold a small map-making contest to design the battlefield. Having a couple of different maps to choose from would be nice.

 

 

 

But first, I would like to ask you guys, if there is an interest in such a contest. Let me know if you think this is something you would like to take part in. We could then use this thread to discus the idea further and plan out the details.

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I am unsure how interesting could that be cause I still don't know much about troops in Crusader 2, but if they don't have any rock/scissor/paper system I fear it wouldn't be that good. I've got feeling that they made it just like:

men-at-arms < macemen < pikemen < swordsmen < knights ...

But I still know very little about those, and true - they do have their special abilities. Maybe it could be interesting because of that. :)

 

Also, another thing we could do is playing with small castles with setting up a limit to number of buildings and troops as well - hoping that this would motivate players to build troops other than knights. :)

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I see what you mean, EaglePrince.

 

Yes, the rock/paper/scissors concept is not very pronounced in the game. I would not say it is not there at all, but yes, the knights are extremely powerful and the "knight spam" is a known tactic.

 

Indeed it would be pretty boring if players just spend all their gold on knights and then march straight at each other for the fight - not much strategy in that.

 

I need to think about this some more. Also, I am happy to hear what other players have to say.

Or if we have other ideas (like the small castles) - I am open to all suggestions. :-)

Edited by Nigel

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Also, we may want to consider the Templars Nightmare mod? I am sure our friend who made the,mod would love involving the mod in something like this. I didn't say the name worrying to write his nick wrong. :D He did bring another attributes to troops as well, right?

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While the rock paper scissor mechanic may not be very pronounced in the game it should be very possible to set up more of a 'siege that' in tactical battle format where both sides get set number of troops and whoever out-maneuvers the other would gain the upper hand and win.

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That, I think is a brilliant idea. Even if we don't use that for this contest, I can definitely see us using that for another.


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The fields have eyes, and the woods have ears.

⁠— Geoffrey Chaucer, The Canterbury Tales: The Knight's Tale

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Davids idea does seem good! Maybe something like that can be implemented. For example, we could simple add a rule that the defender can try to kill the opponents lord. This way there could be more battles on the field, or before the attackers camp... There are a lot of things we could do.

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Some nice thoughts here, guys.

I think what we definitely want is something where players have to command "proper" armies, and not just buy as many as they can of the strongest unit.

 

There are quite a few interesting ideas here:

- a pure field battle with pre-determined armies

- small castles, with enemy lords sitting next to each other as rival neighbours

- a siege, where the defender has an incentieve to come out and try to attack his opponent in the open.

 

 

Whatever we do, we will need a few interesting landscapes for it. So I am thinking that a little mapmaking contest, to give us some maps to play with, would be a good first step. Would you guys be interested to take part?

Edited by Nigel

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I think the idea of a fight like this could be very good and a tactical challange.

I however don't think that we should give pre-determined armies because people will most likely try the same tactic or copy/ counter the enemy.

In my opinion it would be better to give everyone a pre-determined amount of money and then let them chose what troops they want themself.

And really if someone wants to go against me with an army that mainly consists of knight then I wish him good luck because that truly is not how you win, they are very expensive and slow and can be coutered quite easily if you have the troops for it and are not forced to hold one spot.

 

The small castles idea sounds fun but I think that it would most likely end in a waiting contest becuase the defender will most likely have an advantage and thus nobody will want to attack first.

 

But no matter what, I'm up for a battling challange so if this will happen you can count me in.

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Nice to see that you are keeping an eye on this forum, Bolbka. :D

 

 

And it is always good to hear different thoughts and opinions.

In the end we will just have to choose something and simply give it a try.

And we can make adjustments as we go along, if they become neccessary.

 

 

But I am glad to see that there is interest in a new contest.

 

For the next two weeks I will be afk, leaving this Friday. But when I get back, I will get a small mapmaking contest started to give us some battlefields. That should get the ball rolling :)

Edited by Nigel

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I guess you forgot about this then, @Nigel ;)

 

Actually, I only just remembered myself.


Quote

The fields have eyes, and the woods have ears.

⁠— Geoffrey Chaucer, The Canterbury Tales: The Knight's Tale

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That's a lot of good ideas :D and I like the idea of a "field battle" @Lord_Chris knows this from our matches in SH2 :P

 

Really it depends what the competition is about. If it's about tactical manoeuvring decisions then I'd say, players both get the same amount of troops and the same units exactly. All they have to do, is kill the enemy lord (castles would have to be placed to make it playable but there should be no effort to build an industry or defences etc).#

 

However, if the competition is about game-sense in general, then I'd say players have a set amount of gold and the required training buildings, barracks etc. Players cannot earn any more gold and must use the gold they have to buy specific troops. Now, as for knight spam, there are two options. Either ban the knights (and other troops you feel should be banned) or, set a small amount of starter gold. Sure knights are strong, but if one player buys 10 knights, and the other buys 30 crossbowmen, the long range units will win.

 

That's my view anyway :)


"Gofyn wyf am galon hapus, calon onest, calon l?n."

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I used to play a game called Imperial Glory (I know, yet another story :D ) and there you used to have open fields with different terrain. So for example, you'd have hills and highlands in Scotland, in England you'd have a castle (below), and in Russia for example, you'd have snow and mountains.

 

Each player would start at the opposite end of the field, and there would be a few defensive buildings at one end (or maybe even the middle) of a field. The players would then attack each other through open fields, and either attempt to take buildings, or high points .etc, any way to wipe out their opponent. I see a "field battle" as this, where basically two players fight to the death with set troops.

 

The only problem I can see, is that there is no use of artillery .etc, so there aren't any long ranged units, only mid to long ranged.

 

imperial-glory-20050601033650067-000.jpg

 

Is this the kind of thing you have in mind? I think this would be a really good idea. I would say that the player with two armies would be the best option, we're all used to fighting on walls .etc, but without them, perhaps it might be more of a challenge - and maybe make some more interesting results too. The general goal would be to annihilate all enemy forces, or kill the lord. But I'm assuming you'd have to kill all the enemy forces to get to the lord anyway.

 

Someone may even go as far as to re-create entire battle armies (as close as the game will allow) for real battles, Crusader might be able to help us there.


Quote

The fields have eyes, and the woods have ears.

⁠— Geoffrey Chaucer, The Canterbury Tales: The Knight's Tale

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That's actually a great idea Chris. I remember creating those type of games on good ol' Halo :P a lot of people downloaded and favorited it. It works really well, as for Crusader, it should work even better. Small fortifications scattered across the map, and they don't necessarily need to be equal.


"Gofyn wyf am galon hapus, calon onest, calon l?n."

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Thanks, Chris, for bringing this back up.

 

I have not quite forgotten it, but have to admit, that it got on the back burner as I have spent a lot of time looking at FireFly's siege that tournament (which turned out pretty well, from what I have seen).

 

But yes, I am determined to pick the idea of field battles up again and whant you describe above from Imperial Glory is getting quite near it. I will keep using his thread to hammer out the ideas in more detail, but the firs thing we need are a few battlefields (maps). So what I want to do is to start a mapmaking contest for that purpose. Hopefully that will be well recieved and give us some good maps to play on. :)

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